There has been some news in the local media lately that THY pilots doze off and even blackout during the flights due to overloaded flight schedules. Such news has become quite common especially in the last couple of months. Can you tell us about effects of this situation on flight safety?
Of course. All airline companies say flight safety is their priority, but this is just ostensible, as is the case with our company. They talk about it at every opportunity, and also during our training. However, our flight schedules contradict to human physiology. They think that flight safety is nothing more than aircraft maintenance. In addition to this, THY tries to keep up with the European standards set according to the European conditions. For example, our flight schedules are set according to the FTL requirements. FTL means flight time limitations set according to the times airports operate in Europe and the programs of the flight crews. They directly try to apply it here to THY crews.
FTL defines the maximum fight limits and forbids flights above it. But in THY, these are standardised, and this is our biggest problem. For example, a pilot may finish the farthest eastern flight and then continue to the farthest western flight. In addition to this, most of the airports do not operate in certain hours of the night, thus the crew can sleep. But when the flight hours from Turkey are defined according to this standard, we start to work hours before the airports in Europe start a day.
As far as I can understand, FTL defines a maximum limit for cabin and cockpit crews, thus causes extreme fatigue for the crew. How long can this situation last?
I would like to add one more thing. FTL is not applied here as required. FTL has some charts, and THY applies the standards defined in these charts according to what serves best for its interests. The FTL regulation is a mess here. There is no definite document that shows according to which criteria the crews fly. The employers make use of this uncertainty to define our flight schedules as they wish.
But then, you are union members and have the collective agreement. How does your collective agreement work on these FTL regulations?
Due to the pro-government Hava-İş Union management's inaptitude, our collective agreement has no use on this issue. Hava-İş Union has stabbed the workers on the back many times before by signing the present collective agreement behind closed doors to the detriment of the pilots. There are even some contradictions between the collective agreement and FTS. There is a great uncertainty, and THY management makes use of this to increase the level of exploitation. There are 15 thousand flight crews, and yet they have only 85 delegates at the union. You cannot expect a union of this composition to sign decisions to the benefit of the flight crews. The situation in THY quite resembles the one in Turkey's rule; in THY, we have another version of decree laws in Turkey.
Can you give us some examples of flying exhausted?
The most important phases of a flight are takeoff, climb out and descending. I will tell one of my personal experiences. During one of these phases of the flight, I was trying hard to keep awake, and my co-pilot dozed off unintentionally. I experienced such things more than once. My colleagues also talk about such things.
So, you mean that both pilots doze off simultaneously during one of the important phases of a flight.
Yes. We may experiences the effects of exhaustion simultaneously during a flight. This is the scariest scenario a passenger would like to hear.
Are resting times really insufficient?
Definitely so. They even get shorter in time. The written standards give you 12 hours resting time but this time also includes the time a pilot spends to and from the hotel and the time you spend till the flight. Sometimes our hotels can be far away from the airport. In case of an accident, the management is justified since the regulation gives us 12 hours of sleeping time. For example, Bilal Ekşi, the deputy chairman of THY, says the longest flight of THY is to Los Angeles, around 13-14 hours. But we have to be at the airport at least an hour and a half before the fight. We have to be at the airport before our shift begins.
In the example Bilal Ekşi gave, we actually work 16-17 hours in a flight to Los Angeles. This gives you only a couple of hours of sleep before your next fight.
In the past, there used to be four pilots in long haul flights, but now there are three people in the cockpit. The flight time is divided among these pilots, giving an average sleeping time per pilot. Bilal Ekşi sends us e-mails including tragicomic recommendations like dividing resting time as 35, 35 and 30 percent; rather than 33 for each. He believes that we can all rest if we divide the time like he suggested. This is not a joke.
THE TIME A PILOT SPENDS BEFORE GETTING ON THE PLANE IS NOT INCLUDED IN WORK HOURS
What do you mean? A corporate firm like THY forces all cabin crew to illicit work?
Yes, we arrive at our workplace hours before our shifts begin. These hours are not recorded. The system compels us to that. When you consider that there 15 thousand flight crews, and that they, for example, attended ten flights a month, this equals to 150 thousand hours of illicit work. This is the profit of the management.
There is a constant conflict between the interests of employers and employees in a capitalist system. This is the situation in THY. The employer wants to impose more work on the employees and allocate resources to find more cunning ways of doing this, but the workers want to work in better conditions and react against the condition when it gets worse. The history of humanity is full of examples like this. Does Hava-İş Union responsible for protecting your rights do this?
An employer cannot participate to a union meeting, and cannot make a sincerity show with the chairman of the union. However, if a chairman of the union praises Erdoğan [Turkey’s President], such things do happen. The e-mails sent by the union management are either about Afrin operation or religious days. They hide exploitation through such means. The present chairman of Hava-İş union Tatlıbal used to be the visa chief for two years when he was appointed. His father was an AKP MP. Tatlıbal supported constitutional referendum change in 2010 together with Fethullah Gülen and his team. After Tatlıbal became the chairman of the union, they spoiled collective agreement articles, and we started to lose most of our acquired rights.
What do you think about Hava-Sen?
It was founded as the union of aviation workers. The elections held to determine the management of this union was held on a day when most of the pilots and cabin crew were on duty. No one was informed about the election, and only 4,500 pilots and cabin crew were able to attend the election.
On the other hand, Hava-İş Union was defined as the union of the transportation sector. This means that truck drivers are also represented in this union and their votes determined the management that would set our flight rules.
“THEY CAN MAKE OPENING CEREMONY OF the THIRD AIRPORT, BUT IT MAY BE OPENED LATER”
Let’s talk about the Third Airport. Is it safe in terms of runway headings, the runway grounds, flyways of the birds, etc.?
We hope so. All we can do at the moment is having hopes. We will see it in practice. The decision of the construction of such an airport was announced on short notice and the construction work started immediately. The construction process of an airport actually starts with long-termed wind measurement, geographical condition analysis and etc. A foreign engineer told that the ground material of the airport cannot be compressed enough and that this can result in flight safety risks. They will use the construction of this airport as a political means for the elections. They can make the opening ceremony but it may be opened later.
“DANGEROUS MATERIALS AND EVEN JIHADISTS ARE CARRIED”
In the previous years, maybe in 2014, some tape recordings were released. The tape recordings of the executive assistant of THY were also among them. It was about the weapons carried to Nigeria. How much information do the pilots have regarding such issues? Do you know what is being carried at the cargo of each flight? Are there any security gaps or any national and international rules violated?
I do not exactly know whether any international rules are violated. But I can say that our company carries some cargos that the big companies do not consider proper to carry, and that our company makes a huge profit from that. In the tape recording of the conservation between Mustafa Varank, one of Erdoğan’s advisors, and the executive assistant of THY reveals that we carry weapons. Sometimes we are being told that we carry ammunitions but we are never being told whether they are illegal or not. We had colleagues who had to carry FSA militants coming to Turkey for treatment after being injured at the conflicts in Syria. Our planes flew to Hatay province empty and took jihadist in blood. If I am not mistaken, they were carried in exchange for hostages. We have to accept such duties since we fear to lose our jobs.
I would like to ask one more question before we finish the interview. How do you think you will overcome all these difficulties?
I believe that membership to this or that union is not enough for getting organised. We realise that today. When our colleagues remain silent about the dismissal of pilots since they were unionised in Hava-Sen, people get distrustful of union membership. Being a member of the union is not enough, we need strong organisations. We should show that workers are stronger. Otherwise, they can prevent any kind of worker movement through layoffs.
